Curse

MithranArkanere · Jan 23, 2008, 09:01 PM // 21:01

I think inscriptions are good.

They balance economy, removing price spikes.

They make actual rare items rare, removing 'fake' rare items due to weird combinations in common skins.

They allow much more options for the same item. And more upgrades could be added, like they did with wands, foci, shields and the new runes.

Well, I still agree with that some combinations aren't possible with the inscription system. But that's not a con against the system. It's a reason to add more upgrades to the list.

angmar_nite · Jan 23, 2008, 09:11 PM // 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

I think inscriptions are good.

They balance economy, removing price spikes.

Guess what. Players are already equal as far as stats are concerned. They have collectables to thank for that. Price spikes reward those who play the game more often than others. And dont bring up the skill>time comment. Once again collectables have made it so those with ugly perfect mods can beat those with crystallines.

Quote:

They make actual rare items rare, removing 'fake' rare items due to weird combinations in common skins.

Anet doesnt choose rarity last time I checked. The playerbase decides that. Why would something be fake rare?? If one charity guild decided to be nice and give away 100 z keys a day, you bet your ass prices would drop across the board. in the end WE decide if its rare or not.

Quote:

They allow much more options for the same item. And more upgrades could be added, like they did with wands, foci, shields and the new runes.

Well, I still agree with that some combinations aren't possible with the inscription system. But that's not a con against the system. It's a reason to add more upgrades to the list.

Some things should remain rarer than others. The inscription system makes a rare upgrade + rare item very easy to come across.

MithranArkanere · Jan 23, 2008, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Oh... no... Anet DECIDE what drops are rare. Unless you tell me you can hack in their servers and modify the drop tables.

If no one wants an Oni blade, that doesn't make it less rare.
If no one wants an Elite Elementalist Tome, that doens't make it less rare.

Player decide what items they like most and want to pay more for, not their drop rate.

A longswords it's not rare, a vertebreaker should be.

You can't see me · Jan 23, 2008, 09:23 PM // 21:23

Angmar, there is a large difference between rare and valuable.

ShadowsRequiem · Jan 23, 2008, 09:25 PM // 21:25

Keep it the way it is XD we have the HoH chest and Z-chest now for a reason.... start saving up leys and trying to get those oh so rare factions shield skins

But really if you change it my e-penis will disappear! and then i'll HAVE NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! between my legs atleast.

angmar_nite · Jan 24, 2008, 12:02 AM // 00:02

My bad. I meant valuable then. No one cares if it's rare if it's not valuable.

Hyper Cutter · Jan 24, 2008, 01:05 AM // 01:05

Inscriptions don't make anything less rare, they just reveal the actual rarity of weapons (as opposed to the manufactured rarity that comes from discarding the 9/10+ of uninscribable weapons with undesirable mods)...

Also, they completely killed that horribly designed caster weapon system from Prophecies and Factions. I've never seen a dual-attribute or dual-profession caster weapon inscribable EVER, whereas they made up 99% of the caster weapon drops under the old system...

Shayne Hawke · Jan 24, 2008, 01:40 AM // 01:40

Someone will perhaps need to point me to a thread on what's been happening with the GW economy, because as a player that doesn't take much part in merchanting, I hardly notice differences in high-end items' price changes and possible transitions of one thing going from high-end to low-end or vice versa.

Wouldn't changing the system to inscriptions benefit the average player, as a whole? I want to know what it would be like to throw out the top 1% of wealthy GW players, because that would eliminate just about every collector that looks for items that are non-inscribable. Past that, I feel that the functionality of inscriptions is superior to the past system, and therefore I feel it deserves to be changed.

This thread was originally to discuss whether drops in HM should be made inscribable. I think it would be fair to make them inscribable in all campaigns, regardless of difficulty. As far as the current items that are non-inscribable, I don't see any issue in leaving them be, because the average player wouldn't be toying with them anyway, and they'd be the rich relics of the past that collectors would continue to seek.

/signed

HawkofStorms · Jan 24, 2008, 01:42 AM // 01:42

The thing is, before inscriptions, the "actual" rarity of an item wasn't just its skin, but its mods as well. Since, you know, something with good mods AND a desirable skin were rare. Simple mathematics. If there is a 1% chance for a good skined item, and a 1% chance for good stats, there is only a .01% chance of having both.
What A.net did with inscriptions was remove that other 1% that was multipled into the figure. Now "true" rare items appear every 1% of the time.

THAT is what expalins the price drop. It wasn't that prices were artificially inflated before (although, for some items it was, and a lot of bad traders who didn't understand that there req 13 weapon was worth a lot less then an identital req 9 did inflate stuff, but nobody actually bought from them) its just that prices adjusted because the very definition of rarity lost a key part of it (the item's stats).

Yawgmoth · Jan 24, 2008, 04:59 AM // 04:59

For me much more important than the whole economy and prices is the FUN of finding cool rare/unique stuff that got totally killed with the inscription system. I totally love finding rare stuff, the good old feeling is still there in Prophecies and Factions but there's nothing like that in NF and GW:EN where all I get is random piles of separate mods on a skin, bleh, a cool aspect of the game killed.
Don't do that to Factions and Proph, don't let those games suck.

manitoba1073 · Jan 24, 2008, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by You can't see me

See, here's the problem. We're not talking about the past. We're talking about the present, and how the present should change to become the future. If we left everything as it was, the game would be in a very bad spot right now. The idea now is what I point out. The idea then is irrelevent, putting your thoughts the same place as you put mine.

No see heres the thing. Everyone had access to the same things then as they still do except for a few people who only have the PvP only editions of the game. So you see the access to the same items is still the same now as it was then making my point valid. Sorry if you dont like it, but that is how its always been and it still is. However by making all drops inscribable will remove that from the system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

I think inscriptions are good.

They balance economy, removing price spikes.

They make actual rare items rare, removing 'fake' rare items due to weird combinations in common skins.

They allow much more options for the same item. And more upgrades could be added, like they did with wands, foci, shields and the new runes.

Well, I still agree with that some combinations aren't possible with the inscription system. But that's not a con against the system. It's a reason to add more upgrades to the list.

Im sorry but you just dont just add more upgrades to make it good. It would take a nearlly complete overhaul of the system to make those types of combinations possible with teh inscriptions system, otherwise dont think they would have had them possible when they introduced them in the first place

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper Cutter

Also, they completely killed that horribly designed caster weapon system from Prophecies and Factions. I've never seen a dual-attribute or dual-profession caster weapon inscribable EVER, whereas they made up 99% of the caster weapon drops under the old system...

Its funny but those were some the hardest staffs for me to ever find lol. I was lucky to find a multiple attribute staff in 1 outa 100+ staff drops that were gold or purple.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Oh, no.

You just got used to a failing economy system that was never meant to be like that and was slipping out of Anet's hands, hijacked by farmers.

Now, as Anet has stated, works much more like it was intended. With only rare drops going over 100k. They "Considers the game economy to be balanced"

Yet those... things... still drop in Prophecies and Factions..

But feel free to keep trying. I'd love to see a real valid non-selfish argument against Inscriptions worldwide. I can wait until they finally make the update. Hehe...

Funny it was the farmers who keep the prices on most items resonable so place your blame somewhere else before I have to sick the LoLcats on you.

Another funny thing is Ive yet to see a real valid non selfish argument for them to be added worldwide yet either so I guess we are in the same boat. I can wait for them to never make the update also.

MithranArkanere · Jan 24, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Oh... wait... let's see...

- Do special unique skins drop in Prophecies?
No, there are few skins there, and most of them core and not rare at all.

- It's in GW more important the speed of players changing builds that the profit of some players selling stuff?
Yes. It is. Is one of the basics of GW.

I'm not being selfish. I'm being logical.
- The new system has been proved more versatile.
- The new system has been proved better for the economy (and it would be even better if the added the Xunlai Market and Upgrade traders). And with better for the economy I mean 'helps decrease inflation' not 'help increase weath'. A good economy is one with cheap things anyone can afford, not one were some people can get rich.
- All skins can be obtained with the new system already, it's not 'keep those skins safe', no, they are all changed. The only thing that remains old it's the drops in some places. Now there are rare (low drop) items with not rare skins. Rare drops should be always those with rare skins.
- The new system is the 'PvP' standard, and weapons come inscribed in the Zaishen and HoH chest. Things that drop with properties out of the system slip a bit from the PvP 'closed' rules. It's not like allowing PvE skills in PvP, but at least a little bit like of that. PvP is the CORE system. And thus, it must be worldwide.
- The new system centers importance in the base stats of the weapon (skin, req) and not make things more rare due to having some variable property not fixed to the type of the weapon. A longsword is always a longsword, it's not better for having +5 energy or +20%(hexed). Just like with armor.
- The new system allows to move all upgrades from skins you don't like to skins you like, allowing to take the most out of the items you like.
- The new system allows to get some combinations that otherwise you may never get, because some people would never keep them to sell, thinking no one would buy that. An w-upgrade trader would greatly help with this too.
- Some people would stop avoiding some areas due to their 'useless junk' drops.
- The skins that are inscribed but drop without much rarity are now a bit too high in price compared with the uniscribed ones. Jade weapons are almost spit most creatures in the Jade Sea, but if you get an inscribed Jade weapon in a Deep chest, you can sell it for much more that the skin rarity is worth.

And I would NOT allow all those types of combinations in PvP panel.
I would just add some more. Specially for shields, wands and foci, which have really a few.

Tell me one rational reason for make the most typical sword skin, the longsword, have more rarity (I'm not saying value, I mean less chances to drop with perfect base+perfect modifier) that many other Nightfall or Eye of the North skins and waaaaaaay much more rarity that an inscribed longsword.

There is no logical reason to.
So inscriptions must be made worldwide.

Yawgmoth · Jan 24, 2008, 06:44 PM // 18:44

@MithranArkanere

you're just one of the extremelly selfish gimme-everything-supereasy-superfast crowd that don't care about hurting the game and destroying the gaming experience for others but only about being able to get best shiny stuff for yourself with no effort.

Quote:

- The new system has been proved more versatile.

Actually LESS versatile, just far EASIER, which wasn't necessary at all.

Quote:

- The new system has been proved better for the economy (and it would be even better if the added the Xunlai Market and Upgrade traders). And with better for the economy I mean 'helps decrease inflation' not 'help increase weath'. A good economy is one with cheap things anyone can afford, not one were some people can get rich.

OMFG The economy was in far better state before Nightfall.
The new system didn't 'help decrease inflation', that's what loot scaling did.
And a good economy is one where supply and demand are balanced, NOT one that's overflooded with perfect stuff thats worth shit that nobody wants to buy. EPIC FAIL.

Quote:

- The new system is the 'PvP' standard, and weapons come inscribed in the Zaishen and HoH chest. Things that drop with properties out of the system slip a bit from the PvP 'closed' rules. It's not like allowing PvE skills in PvP, but at least a little bit like of that. PvP is the CORE system. And thus, it must be worldwide.

This is the PvP standard but it was never needed in PvE at all!
Also this change would DEVASTATE the value of many HOH / Zaishen chest drops - mostly the canthan skins which are still pretty rare in perfect versions. This would make them suck as much as all the other overfarmed crap.

Quote:

- Some people would stop avoiding some areas due to their 'useless junk' drops.

The 'useless junk' wasn't that useless before this crappy system. And the good stuff that dropped there (and thankfully still does) is well worth it, far better than inscribable crap.

Quote:

Tell me one rational reason for make the most typical sword skin, the longsword, have more rarity (I'm not saying value, I mean less chances to drop with perfect base+perfect modifier) that many other Nightfall or Eye of the North skins and waaaaaaay much more rarity that an inscribed longsword.

So the fact there are lots of skins crapified by having them drop as perfect inscribable versions from common mobs, thus making them greatly overfarmed, means that it's logical to make the remaining ones just like that - turn into overfarmed crap? Utter nonsense.

This whole idea is bad beyond all imagination and fails on multiple fronts, hurting even the PvP players rewards greatly.

Stop being selfish.

Sarevok Thordin · Jan 24, 2008, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Here is what I think.

It's far easier for me to get a perfect item with a skin I may want without having to farm day and night to pay someone an arm/leg/firstborn for it. I don't care if they don't get their cash, I'm on a more even footing with them.

Moreso, if I did have to farm/sacrifice another slot for a dedicated farming chacter, I don't need to deal with having to repeat farm after getting the item due to a single % off or a sundering mod being on it.

Get over it, the new system is better for the player, not the trader which I don't really care about.

Rare skins remain rare (I haven't SEEN a runic blade drop yet either!), that's enough.

Longasc · Jan 24, 2008, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

@MithranArkanere
(...)
Stop being selfish.

Stop being a dick, he is not the guy that needs a special rare weapon drop and the questionable reward of getting 1 usable drop out of 100 to feel good.

You want that, but you call him selfish for asking for something that is better for everyone - except people that demand that there should be very rare and valuable skins at the cost of having a lot of useless garbage drop without inscription slot. Oh my!

Snow Bunny · Jan 24, 2008, 06:56 PM // 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

@MithranArkanere

you're just one of the extremelly selfish gimme-everything-supereasy-superfast crowd that don't care about hurting the game and destroying the gaming experience for others but only about being able to get best shiny stuff for yourself with no effort.

Actually LESS versatile, just far EASIER, which wasn't necessary at all.

OMFG The economy was in far better state before Nightfall.
The new system didn't 'help decrease inflation', that's what loot scaling did.
And a good economy is one where supply and demand are balanced, NOT one that's overflooded with perfect stuff thats worth shit that nobody wants to buy. EPIC FAIL.

This is the PvP standard but it was never needed in PvE at all!
Also this change would DEVASTATE the value of many HOH / Zaishen chest drops - mostly the canthan skins which are still pretty rare in perfect versions. This would make them suck as much as all the other overfarmed crap.

The 'useless junk' wasn't that useless before this crappy system. And the good stuff that dropped there (and thankfully still does) is well worth it, far better than inscribable crap.

So the fact there are lots of skins crapified by having them drop as perfect inscribable versions from common mobs, thus making them greatly overfarmed, means that it's logical to make the remaining ones just like that - turn into overfarmed crap? Utter nonsense.

This whole idea is bad beyond all imagination and fails on multiple fronts, hurting even the PvP players rewards greatly.

Stop being selfish.

I love you

Marry me?

manitoba1073 · Jan 24, 2008, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Oh... wait... let's see...

- Do special unique skins drop in Prophecies?
No, there are few skins there, and most of them core and not rare at all.
.

Yes there is rare skins in prophicies considiering for the most part all of prophicies really is core.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- It's in GW more important the speed of players changing builds that the profit of some players selling stuff?
Yes. It is. Is one of the basics of GW.
.

That is why we have the templates its about the skills you use not the weapons you use. Unless you wanna try to convince me otherwise on that case.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

I'm not being selfish. I'm being logical.
.

That is still debateable

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system has been proved more versatile.
.

No it hasnt. It has actually removed alot of the versatility out of the game for those players that only have NF and dont have access to those mods that are not in the incriptions systems.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system has been proved better for the economy (and it would be even better if the added the Xunlai Market and Upgrade traders). And with better for the economy I mean 'helps decrease inflation' not 'help increase weath'. A good economy is one with cheap things anyone can afford, not one were some people can get rich.
.

The farmers are the ones that have increased supply thank you very much. I dont care if a few people get rich off things I know gold ingame isnt as important as some think it is except for a few things.

The Xunlai market idea was my idea along time ago so thank you again for for liking my idea. I would also like to have upgrade traders also never said I didnt.

A good economy is one that supports all kinds things and not limiting to one idea. Maybe a class in ecomonics is in hand for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- All skins can be obtained with the new system already, it's not 'keep those skins safe', no, they are all changed. The only thing that remains old it's the drops in some places. Now there are rare (low drop) items with not rare skins. Rare drops should be always those with rare skins.
.

Wrong again since it has nothing to do with skins. Its about the inscriptions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system is the 'PvP' standard, and weapons come inscribed in the Zaishen and HoH chest. Things that drop with properties out of the system slip a bit from the PvP 'closed' rules. It's not like allowing PvE skills in PvP, but at least a little bit like of that. PvP is the CORE system. And thus, it must be worldwide.
.

Wrong again PvP is not core system in this game it is both PvE Pvp that is core. If you dont like that then please use the uninstall button.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system centers importance in the base stats of the weapon (skin, req) and not make things more rare due to having some variable property not fixed to the type of the weapon. A longsword is always a longsword, it's not better for having +5 energy or +20%(hexed). Just like with armor.
.

The system has been that way to a degree since the game was made. Not just since the inscriptions were added.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system allows to move all upgrades from skins you don't like to skins you like, allowing to take the most out of the items you like.
.

So here we have it what I said you were really about. Its not really about the inscriptions but about the skins. Nice to finally admit the truth isnt it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The new system allows to get some combinations that otherwise you may never get, because some people would never keep them to sell, thinking no one would buy that. An w-upgrade trader would greatly help with this too.
.

So some people who make mistakes on selling to the merchants. Still not a valid reason for adding inscriptions

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- Some people would stop avoiding some areas due to their 'useless junk' drops.
.

Well then most palyers would need to avoid 99% of the game then huh.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

- The skins that are inscribed but drop without much rarity are now a bit too high in price compared with the uniscribed ones. Jade weapons are almost spit most creatures in the Jade Sea, but if you get an inscribed Jade weapon in a Deep chest, you can sell it for much more that the skin rarity is worth.

Prices is not fixed if you dont like the price someone is selling for its simple dont buy it. Always been that way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

And I would NOT allow all those types of combinations in PvP panel.
I would just add some more. Specially for shields, wands and foci, which have really a few.

So its cause you dont want certain combinations to be used in PvP. Wow that dont sound selfish at all now does it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Tell me one rational reason for make the most typical sword skin, the longsword, have more rarity (I'm not saying value, I mean less chances to drop with perfect base+perfect modifier) that many other Nightfall or Eye of the North skins and waaaaaaay much more rarity that an inscribed longsword.

There is no logical reason to.
So inscriptions must be made worldwide.

This is to funny here. Who cares about the rarity of the skin for longsword or any other skin for that matter as it has no functionality to it.

The only thing a skin is for is vanity.

so once again where is your so called logical reason as its still not there.

heres my again since you seem to want the same answer -

The removal of certain combinations is more than enough reason alone to keep inscriptions from being implemented worldwide. Has nothing to do with value of those combinations.

So you dont think again Im only trying to blow smoke up ur A$$. couple weeks ago I was in Rata Sum and people were discussion how much people had and I said how much I had. A gurl or guy dont care who it was said they couldnt believe people could have that much and said they had never even seen a crystallinne sword before so i gave them a q8 max one.

manitoba1073 · Jan 24, 2008, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarevok Thordin

Here is what I think.

It's far easier for me to get a perfect item with a skin I may want without having to farm day and night to pay someone an arm/leg/firstborn for it. I don't care if they don't get their cash, I'm on a more even footing with them.

Moreso, if I did have to farm/sacrifice another slot for a dedicated farming chacter, I don't need to deal with having to repeat farm after getting the item due to a single % off or a sundering mod being on it.

Get over it, the new system is better for the player, not the trader which I don't really care about.

Rare skins remain rare (I haven't SEEN a runic blade drop yet either!), that's enough.

so you think things cost a ton heres some thing I payed 7k for yeap really expensive and that was 25 months ago I got this minus the sundering mod

yeap really had to break the bank to buy that or farm yrs to afford it huh.

Diddy bow · Jan 24, 2008, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Oh... wait... let's see...

- Do special unique skins drop in Prophecies?
No, there are few skins there, and most of them core and not rare at all.

- It's in GW more important the speed of players changing builds that the profit of some players selling stuff?
Yes. It is. Is one of the basics of GW.

I'm not being selfish. I'm being logical.
- The new system has been proved more versatile.
- The new system has been proved better for the economy (and it would be even better if the added the Xunlai Market and Upgrade traders). And with better for the economy I mean 'helps decrease inflation' not 'help increase weath'. A good economy is one with cheap things anyone can afford, not one were some people can get rich.
- All skins can be obtained with the new system already, it's not 'keep those skins safe', no, they are all changed. The only thing that remains old it's the drops in some places. Now there are rare (low drop) items with not rare skins. Rare drops should be always those with rare skins.
- The new system is the 'PvP' standard, and weapons come inscribed in the Zaishen and HoH chest. Things that drop with properties out of the system slip a bit from the PvP 'closed' rules. It's not like allowing PvE skills in PvP, but at least a little bit like of that. PvP is the CORE system. And thus, it must be worldwide.
- The new system centers importance in the base stats of the weapon (skin, req) and not make things more rare due to having some variable property not fixed to the type of the weapon. A longsword is always a longsword, it's not better for having +5 energy or +20%(hexed). Just like with armor.
- The new system allows to move all upgrades from skins you don't like to skins you like, allowing to take the most out of the items you like.
- The new system allows to get some combinations that otherwise you may never get, because some people would never keep them to sell, thinking no one would buy that. An w-upgrade trader would greatly help with this too.
- Some people would stop avoiding some areas due to their 'useless junk' drops.
- The skins that are inscribed but drop without much rarity are now a bit too high in price compared with the uniscribed ones. Jade weapons are almost spit most creatures in the Jade Sea, but if you get an inscribed Jade weapon in a Deep chest, you can sell it for much more that the skin rarity is worth.

And I would NOT allow all those types of combinations in PvP panel.
I would just add some more. Specially for shields, wands and foci, which have really a few.

Tell me one rational reason for make the most typical sword skin, the longsword, have more rarity (I'm not saying value, I mean less chances to drop with perfect base+perfect modifier) that many other Nightfall or Eye of the North skins and waaaaaaay much more rarity that an inscribed longsword.

There is no logical reason to.
So inscriptions must be made worldwide.

Well of cource there is no reason not to when you only look at one side of the argument...

Inscription items are all fine and good if you dont think rare items have any place. But "A good economy is one with cheap things anyone can afford" was true before. A high req 15^50 longsword was still well within a "casual" (i know it has alot of diffrent meanings so quote marks ftw!) players reach, rather than being well within a levels 2's reach who cant figure out how to change his skill bar yet.

Swapping the system would just make all the non inscription items more expensive and hared to obtain, with customisation they would just go bigger and bigger. Alternitivly going commy and making all items oncription would just piss loads of people off for no reason other than letting new players get skins they can already get.

You can get a req 13 of just about any skin (excluding the rare ones, but they are rare either way) from the zaishen chest or just buy it from the change you found in the street. So why is there a problem with the way now? Is people having a weapon with personal presige value over the common ones bad?

So why implement this? All the weapons that would drop are already easy to optain, HM should have valuble drops, apparently.

Sarevok Thordin · Jan 24, 2008, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

so you think things cost a ton heres some thing I payed 7k for yeap really expensive and that was 25 months ago I got this minus the sundering mod

yeap really had to break the bank to buy that or farm yrs to afford it huh.

It was 1pm when I wrote that post and I was just up >_>

Maybe I shoulda say req 12 instead :P